All of this has happened before and all of it will happen again, I'm not treading any new ground.
A recent youtube video by " Students and Young Americans for Senator John McCain" has brought my attention back to Gulliver's Travels greatest quote:
It is allowed on all hands, that the primitive way of breaking eggs before we eat them, was upon the larger end: but his present Majesty's grandfather, while he was a boy, going to eat an egg, and breaking it according to the ancient practice, happened to cut one of his fingers. Whereupon the Emperor his father published an edict, commanding all his subjects, upon great penalties, to break the smaller end of their eggs.
The people so highly resented this law, that our Histories tell us there have been six rebellions raised on that account, wherein one Emperor lost his life, and another his crown. These civil commotions were constantly formented by the monarchs of Blefuscu, and when they were quelled, the exiles always fled for refuge to that Empire.
It is computed, that eleven thousand persons have, at several times, suffered death, rather than submit to break their eggs at the smaller end. Many hundred large volums have been published upon this controversy: but the books of the BigEndians have been long forbidden, and the whole party rendered incapable by law of holding employments.
During the course of these troubles, the emperors of Blefuscu did frequently expostulate by their ambassadors, accusing us of making a schism in religion, by offending against a fundamental doctrine of our great prophet Lustrog, in the fiftyfourth chapter of the Brundecral (which is their Alcoran). This, however, is thought to be a mere strain upon the text: for their words are these; That all true believers shall break their eggs at the convenient end: and which is the convenient end, seems, in my humble opinion, to be left to every man's conscience, or at least in the power of the chief magistrate to determine. .
The video juxtaposes threats of foreign hordes spending money on weapons to destroy America, cut with footage of BHO proposing cutting the Department of Defense budget and downplaying the threat of the foreign hordes looking to do harm to our freedom.
But the last part of the video is the kicker, the video closes out with a BHO quote, a "KnownFact?" and an appeal to emotion to hammer home the point of the video:
BHO quote: "The sole priority of Defense spending, will be to protect the America people"
Fact from a Book: "1993-2001 the Clinton administration cut Defense and Intelligence Spending by 35% - “Changing Dynamics of Defense Spending. Leon Sigal”" [1991 - USSR collapsed, 1991 - Gulf War ends, 1993 new President starts to cut military spending]
Appeal to Emotion: " 9 Months later [video of plane hitting one of the WTC towers]
I guess the premise of the video is that BHO won't spend enough money in the right places to keep American lives safe. Or that the Iraqi government doesn't really mean it when they say the Iraqi's wants foreign troops out and that BHO will abandoned them [is US security at too great a risk to leave up the democratically elected Iraqi government]? Or is the premise that the foreign hordes will fire ICBM's at the US and BHO will have the US military hog tied and unready to fight off either North Korea, Russia, Iraq, China...?
Who funded the video, the good folks at Boeing?
---------
This youtube attack piece just brings me back to my youth when a POTUS with a "D" next is name, Bill Clinton, tried to "Wag the Dog" to bring attention away from the fact that Bill received the other kind of sodomy from the "wrong" woman. Along with "AT LEAST TEN REASONS TO OPPOSE INITIATION OF WAR ON IRAQ"
[ from a conservative nonetheless, I guess it was a ploy to get Al Gore as POTUS.]
Back in the late 90's, strikes aimed at Saddam and The Base were considered "Wat the Dog" and an distraction from the real threats of Red China, North Korea, and "amoral" activity in the Oval Office
Albeit the two previous links was just one person spouting off that happened to put "conservative" in the domain name and certain facts have become more apparent later on.
Then along comes a POTUS with a different letter next to his name, and a lack of new reliable evidence on existence or non-existence of Saddam's WMD , and a new strike by bin Laden's group of merry xenophobes and then many conservatives pulled a 180 on their views of Invading Iraq.
An oddly little known Islamic terrorist group hits their mark and Saddam's name recognition along with the fact that all people are ignorant fools [on too many topics] leads 70% of Americans to think their is a link between a paranoid megalomaniac secular [Sunni] Dictator and Sunni xenophobes
. Thats people on both sides of the aisle.
I'm confounded by the number of people that originally supported giving Bush the option to use force invaded Iraq whether the UN approved but now stand in opposition to the war.
The Iraqi oil will pay for itself argument was laughable. As if Saddam's "cohorts" wouldn't do their best to muck up oil production or take steps to raise the US cost of the invasion.
The argument that the Iraqi's will greet foreign infidels as liberators was a stretch, the Hatfields , McCoys
, and Kurds were reason enough to doubt all sides would trust foreigners enough to not seize control themselves. [It doesn't take a History Degree from an Ivy League school to know that the Shia, Sunni, and Kurds don't like eachother
About the only reason Saddam would not fully comply with the UN [and not have WMD] would be to give the perception that he was standing up to Western Powers, and/or to keep Iran guessing whether Saddam actually had or was looking to get usable WMD.
Saddam and The bin Laden Base working together would have been an unlikely union, no hindsight needed.
So there are many reasons why the Iraq War is and was doing better than could be expected back in early 2003.
Things could have been much worse
To some, Bill Clinton's rationale for Invading Iraq was "Wag the Dog" or for others it was a good thing to get a tyrant out of power.
To others, GWB's rationale for Invading Iraq was for the Bush43 administration to lie to themselves or for others it was a good thing to get a tyrant out of power
9/11 would have likely been used as different forms of political currency by 2 recent POTUS' as leverage to Invade Iraq.
__________________________
In our society, people are rewarded for pretending to be certain about things they're clearly not certain about. -- Sam Harris,
Saddam Hussein was Sunni
He put down several rebellions by the Shia and mainly relied on Sunnis in his administration. Remember shortly after the invasion when most of our trouble came from "dead enders" in the Sunni regions of Iraq?
__________________________"You have seen how a man was made a slave; you shall see how a slave was
made a man." --Frederick Douglas
Typo correctted
Iran was mostly Shia, and Saddam was Sunni...al Qaeda is religious, Saddam was not.
__________________________In our society, people are rewarded for pretending to be certain about things they're clearly not certain about. -- Sam Harris,
on a roll
You were really on a roll when you wrote the above piece. That one point just tripped me up a little. As far as typos go, it doesn't match up to the worst (best?) I've ever seen, when someone wrote "inciteful" when they meant "insightful"
__________________________"You have seen how a man was made a slave; you shall see how a slave was
made a man." --Frederick Douglas
Hmmm...
I find that particular video very disturbing as well. But for a whole different set of reasons.
I won't go through the issues line by line, but suffice it to say, we have been fighting the war on terror in Iraq, we have killed the enemy in large numbers and have them back on their heels -FLASH - During that same period of time we in America have enjoyed a terror free environment!
Like the war in Iraq or not, it was, and is the right thing to do. And when we finish cleaning house there, we will continue to kill terrorists throughout Afghanistan and into the badlands of Pakistan, until the last terrorist standing is killed. (Funny enough, since his trip, and getting all excited about redeploying our troops, it sounds like BHO now agrees on that much!)
Sounds radical, not to me.
What would we be like today if...oh, lets say in WW2, having the enemy back on its heels, retreating into the relative safety of their homeland, Roosevelt made the unthinkable decision to redeploy Patton and the US troops to the south Pacific believing we had done our part, or the war had cost to much, or the toll in lives had become enough?
Spreken zie Deutsch Brutus?
So when I see BHO espousing concepts about these foreign policy and CIC issues, I shudder!
And it goes farther than the video even shows, like BHO making policy statements on Iraq, without ever consulting Gen. Patraeus?
Barack Obama would be the most liberal, radically oriented POTUS in US history.
His personal and professional associations, lack of experience, inability to stay committed to his positions, taxes, spending, immigration, etc., etc., etc. all point to a big thumbs down for the Jr Senator from Ill.
So, I thought the video was very well done and on point!
__________________________"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. And moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue." ~ B. Goldwater
Let's drage a WWII into this.. the US doesn't exist in a vacuum.
When is this so called time of "having the enemy back on its heels, retreating into the relative safety of their homeland, " which would all be turned around if FDR focused on the Japanese Empire.
1: The Germans still occupied foreign territory far from Deutschland when they surrendered.
2: The Soviets did a lot of the heavy lifting near the tail end of the European Theater after, and before, the Battle of the Bulge. Over 450,000 thousand Soviet soldiers died taking Berlin, zero Americans [Harry must have done the unthinkable and gave up]
3: Are you implying that the current Iraqi army are like the Soviets and both are too inept to do anything right ?
4: Iraq is now a sovereign state now.
5: NIMBY is not a good cause to go to war, "We're fighting "them" [in the Iraqi's front yard, back yard, and in their houses] so that "they" don't come over here."
???????????
__________________________In our society, people are rewarded for pretending to be certain about things they're clearly not certain about. -- Sam Harris,
I have trouble...
...being as presumptuous as you, and thinking I have somehow a better grip of the details than General David Petraeus!
A man who spent his entire lifetime studying the art of war.
A man who has as intimate an understanding of the nature of the conflict in Iraq and Afghanistan as anyone on the planet.
We should move the troops when, and deploy them where, he and his colleagues find appropriate.
BHO should not politicize these men's and woman's jobs. Not in a time of war. Not when they have been called to, and died for this cause.
It would be a spit in the face of all Americans to undo the good work that has been done, especially by a politician, an inexperienced, naive, radical liberal politician at that.
It goes right to the heart of that video, he is out of touch with what is really going on in the world, and as John McCain so aptly put it, "BHO is willing to lose a war to win an election".
__________________________"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. And moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue." ~ B. Goldwater
You remind me of another poster
here, GoRight.
He is like a walking talking memo for right wing talking points.
__________________________It is the economy, stupid.
You remind me of...
...Barack Obama.
Talk a lot, but say very little, if anything substantive!
All you've done is talk trash, you've not made one legitimate point in this whole thread regarding the issues at hand.
Ok, Miss Liberty, lets be friends. If I'm so off base, it would be an easy task for a liberal like yourself to straighten out the mis-characterizations you seem to find inherent in my "talking points" as you call my views?
Lets talk about the issues and see where it leads us. Isn't that the premise of why we're here?
(By the way, if you think I sound like a Republican, gee, I wonder what you think you sound like?)
__________________________"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. And moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue." ~ B. Goldwater
The problem
as I see it is that some have an inherent contempt and disrespect for those with whom they disagree.
As for straightening you out, I think it's too late. :)
What makes politics so difficult is that our system is set up so that to get things done of necessity you must compromise. At this time, there is an awful lot of money or lobbyist influence that is circumventing the democratic process.
I am at war with wedge issue politics. I hate it. I despise it.
Flaring folks up about Paris Hilton and Hitler really doesn't serve the peoples needs, and is a mask for the real reason that some folks want to stay in power. They want to keep the money in their own hands. But as we see from your posts, once a lie gets started, it doesn't even matter if it's a lie. The contagion spreads like wildfire, and presto, Barack Obama is Hitler in disguse, ready to 'kill whitey' and keep black people on welfare for life, or some other foolish dribble.
__________________________It is the economy, stupid.
How in the world do you...
...come to that conclusion?
I guess no matter what the question is about BHO, it becomes a part of some larger fantastic story telling? Hey, great tatic. Won't work, but it's clever. Anytime anyone asks a question about him, you can just call him a racist of some sort, or bring up some internet rumors?
How sad.
I brought up legitimate, FACT based information, information that whether you like it or not, makes Americans very concerned, and rightly so in my opinion!
Facts. And you can't deal? Wow? I expected more.
__________________________"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. And moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue." ~ B. Goldwater
Not to mention...
Red_Wing is attacking positions that I never advocated.
__________________________In our society, people are rewarded for pretending to be certain about things they're clearly not certain about. -- Sam Harris,
This was replyed to Miss L, sorry for the confusion. :-)
If you are referring to the posts up above, I was directing my comments to you yes, comment and address it above if you think it was not on point?
I was engaging you in debate, given what I gleaned from your posts elsewhere.
If I was wrong, I apologize.
__________________________"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. And moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue." ~ B. Goldwater
So say we all.
This has all been said before, McCain is working off the script of a cable sci-fi show.
__________________________In our society, people are rewarded for pretending to be certain about things they're clearly not certain about. -- Sam Harris,
12 Monkeys
I'm sorry if I don't believe the Cassandras
of the world.
"His personal and professional associations"
[Chester Arthur] came into office handicapped by a record in machine politics and grave doubt as to his ability and integrity, but his administration proved honest, efficient, and dignified. He effectively supported the civil service reform act of 1883.
"lack of experience"
"radically oriented"
etc
__________________________In our society, people are rewarded for pretending to be certain about things they're clearly not certain about. -- Sam Harris,
I'm not sure...
...that is sufficient evidence to erase any doubts regarding Barack Obama?
Why no evidence, facts, or supporting information as to why we should not feel this way, all we ever seem to get is accusations, conjecture, and hyperbole?
__________________________"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice. And moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue." ~ B. Goldwater